What impact is stress actually having on our muscle tissue and our ability to lose body fat? Can a workout be too stressful, or does it actually act as stress relief? And how do our stress hormones interact with hormones like estrogen and insulin?
Today I’m diving into the body’s stress response for women in different life stages, key data points to let you know if your stress levels are elevated too much, and 12 ways that you can build more stress resilience into your daily life to help you mitigate the damaging impact too much stress can have on your body.
Because let’s face it – we’re always going to be dealing with stress, stressful events and having to process the impacts this has on our bodies. Stress management is about you taking control of what you have control over, and developing a regular practice that strengthens your response to stress.
By mindfully bringing yourself into a calm state regularly, it becomes easier to self-regulate and get yourself back to equilibrium in the face of stressful events. This can help you mitigate the harmful impact that prolonged stress can have on your body, and the disruptions it can cause to your hormones levels, ability to regulate body fat, sculpt lean muscle and energy balance.
In this episode I’m exploring…
⭐️ How the stress response works in your body
⭐️How we can mitigate muscle loss and fat storage
⭐️ How insulin resistance and insulin sensitivity play a role in weight gain
⭐️ The connection between your estrogen and the insulin response
⭐️ Eating tips for keeping blood sugar stable with your cycle, in perimenopause and post-menopause
⭐️ How to monitor your body’s response to stress: data points like hormone levels, blood pressure, RHR and HRV
⭐️ 12 tools to help your body deal with stress and improve your stress resilience
Links to follow up from this episode:
- How estrogen impacts your body’s response to exercise and more
- Blood tests and hormone therapy options podcast with Dr. Jill Carnahan
- More about your blood pressure
- More about your resting heart rate (RHR)
- More about heart rate variability (HRV) and how it’s measured
- Podcast about Acupuncture and how it works with acupuncture practitioner Ashlie Klavon
- EMDR Therapy
- The Calm app
- The Balance app
- Heart Math app and device
- 6 Adaptogenic Herbs that support hormone balance and our stress response
- Betty Rocker training programs, balanced and optimized for women in different life stages
Episode Transcript
New TabBetty Rocker (00:16):
What’s up, rock stars Coach Betty Rocker here. And thank you so much for tuning in today because I really wanted to talk about this important thing, which is stress management. And why I talk about stress management and why I think it’s just as important to schedule in the same way we schedule in our workouts is because the resilience that we can build through practices like mindfulness and meditation help us respond better to the stress we deal with and the anxiety we feel in our day-to-day life, it’s like how your workout gives you more physical strength to handle the tasks you do in your daily life. Your stress management practices built up over time help your body deal with the burden that stress places on you and helps to mitigate its impact. So you know, let’s talk a little bit about how that stress response actually works.
(01:08)
So when we’re triggered by a stressful event, a signal is sent to the command center in our brain, which is the hypothalamus, and that regulates our sympathetic and parasympathetic nervous response systems. So the sympathetic nervous system triggers the fight or flight response, which provides your body with a burst of energy so it can potentially respond to danger. The parasympathetic nervous system is the rest and digest response that calms our body. So when something stressful happens, your command center activates your sympathetic nervous system, that fight or flight response and your adrenal glands release adrenaline into your bloodstream, which makes your heart beat faster. Your breathing speeds up and extra oxygen gets sent to your brain. You, your senses get more tuned in like your sight and your hearing becomes sharper. And also blood sugar and fats are released from temporary storage sites around your body, which floods your bloodstream with them to supply you with energy just in case you need to fight or to run away from danger.
(02:11)
Now, after that first surge of the adrenaline subsides, the command center goes into its secondary response system protocol it, it triggers your HPA axis to release cortisol. And HPA stands for hypothalamus pituitary gland and adrenal gland. So there’s a lot involved in this secondary command system right now. Once your sympathetic nervous system has been activated and then it stays activated, your body’s engine is running at like these really high RPMs, you’re all revved up and you’re like ready for anything. And this would be good if you needed to fight or flee from danger. But way too often we’re triggering this system with daily life stress and it’s causing these hormones to be present in our bodies so often that they have a effect. When adrenaline runs through the body too often it can increase our blood pressure and cause damage to the blood vessels and the arteries, which raises the risk of heart attacks and stroke.
(03:10)
And if cortisol levels are elevated for too long, this can create an ongoing buildup of fat tissue and cause weight gain and also break down muscle tissue and impact our immune system health. So I don’t want you to think that your cortisol, which is a natural hormone made by your body, is a bad hormone. Neither is adrenaline. Both of these hormones serve highly important purposes. For instance, cortisol levels run on a cyclical schedule and are normally at their lowest at night and then begin to slowly rise in the early hours of the morning, which is part of what helps you wake up. So when we have normal levels of cortisol, they’re supporting the body’s sleep wake cycle, which is super important. But like we talked about with stress, when cortisol is elevated over long periods of time, not just in an isolated event, we end up suffering the consequences of things like poor sleep, weight gain, muscle loss, and a lowered immune response.
(04:06)
And one of the other impacts that heightened ongoing stress and rampant cortisol in your body can have that also directly impacts weight gain is that it interferes with our insulin response. So insulin is the hormone that helps to unlock your cells to receive the glucose from the nutrient dense foods that you eat. And insulin helps us keep our blood sugar levels stable by unlocking the cells to receive that glucose. And we wanna keep our blood sugar levels stable so we can have that steady energy to think to move and like function. Normally without insulin acting as the key to your cells, your body can’t put the glucose where it needs to go. So insulin sensitivity is the amount of insulin you need to unlock your cells. If you’re insulin sensitive, you need less insulin to unlock your cells to receive that glucose. This is the efficient scenario.
(04:59)
We wanna keep active because your body can store the glucose you don’t need for immediate energy in three primary places, your liver, your muscle tissue, or your fat cells. Now nutrient partitioning describes which of these three paths will be taken and that has a lot to do with your current amount of body fat, your current amount of muscle tissue and your hormone levels, particularly your insulin levels. If you have good insulin sensitivity, muscle and liver storage is gonna be prioritized and you get the bonus benefit of aiding your amino acids and entering the muscle tissue as well for muscle protein synthesis, which helps you repair and strengthen your muscle tissue. Now insulin is a hard worker and when there’s a lot of glucose to process, it jumps into action and portions out the storage it has in each spot in the body. But what happens is if you’ve met your immediate energy needs and your liver is at capacity and your muscles don’t have any more space left, it does the only thing left that it can do, which is put the rest of the glucose in storage in your fat cells.
(05:58)
Now, we may not be super excited about the fact that we’re storing some fat, but the truth is your body is pretty amazing. And this function is an important one because if you ate a meal with more sugar than you need for energy and your other storage tanks are full, the sugar has to go somewhere. The the problem is when this happens, too often a dangerous condition that’s known as insulin resistance can occur if insulin is that key that unlocks the cell door to allow glucose in. Insulin resistance is what happens when the key gets jammed and it can’t unlock the door anymore. And that means there’s more sugar circulating in your bloodstream and the levels keep rising. And this can damage our organs and our nerves and it’s associated with obesity, type two diabetes, high cholesterol and high blood pressure. And once insulin resistance develops the muscles, the fat and the liver cells don’t respond to it properly, which leads to this chain reaction in the body that impacts the effectiveness and balance of other hormones as well.
(06:57)
So this is one of the reasons we want to eat balanced meals and be mindful of our sugar intake because of how hard that insulin response system has to work to unlock all of those doors so your body can uptake the glucose you take in and and because we can actually break the lock mechanism that insulin functions as over time by constantly flooding the body with too much sugar, we wanna really be mindful of how we’re eating so that we’re not impacting that process. Now our hormones don’t play solo acts. They are like a symphony and they’re always playing off each other and, and one of the reasons I bring all of this up about insulin is because the risk of developing insulin resistance is really increased by elevated cortisol levels. And as you now know, cortisol is the hormone that gets triggered by stress and, and estrogen is actually a big helper in our cells for optimizing the insulin response.
(07:54)
And when our estrogen levels are low, our insulin receptors become less functional and the body can’t handle glucose as efficiently then either. So if you’re still in your cycling years, you may have experienced the PMS symptom of craving sugar before your period. And one of the reasons this happens is because our estrogen levels are at their lowest point at this stage of our cycle. And if you’re in perimenopause, progesterone and estrogen levels may be fluctuating causing imbalances in the function of these two key hormones, right? And that can also raise your risk for developing insulin sensitivity, especially if your stress levels are high and going unchecked. If you’re post menopause, your estrogen levels have dropped to their lowest point and it becomes essential to pay attention to supporting your body’s insulin response and stress response because some of the support for that system is no longer in action.
(08:46)
So one of your first lines of defense for any life stage is to eat balanced whole foods and avoid foods with added sugar. You know, I’m all about moderation, so I don’t recommend being too rigid and never allowing yourself to enjoy dessert or have sugar, right? But it is so important to understand what too much of it over time can do to your body. So you really wanna watch out for overeating, processed foods, foods with added sugars, soda, alcohol, going too much low fat, which will be less satisfying ultimately, and also speeds up how fast sugar gets into your bloodstream. And when you watch out for these things, it can really help mitigate your PMS symptoms. It can support you in perimenopause and also post menopause and and just increase your body’s ability to handle fluctuating hormone levels more efficiently and easily. And a side note on my low fat comment.
(09:40)
You know, when we include healthy fat from whole foods in our diet, the fat slows down how quickly food leaves our stomach, also having the effect of regulating our blood sugar, which makes it so insulin doesn’t have to work as hard. And also when we eat fiber dense whole food carbohydrates, there’s a similar effect where the sugar doesn’t hit your bloodstream as quickly as the stripped down sort of processed carbs do. And fiber can also benefit you if you’re at a point where your hormones are out of balance. Like say in perimenopause for instance, where we sometimes experience estrogen dominance. One of the cool things about eating a fiber rich diet is that fiber helps bind to excess hormones and carry them from the body. So paying attention to your gut health and regularly including fiber, probiotic rich foods and fermented foods will help you stay more balanced and reduce the inflammation that can occur.
(10:31)
When we eat a lot of food that irritates our gut. And when we include an optimal amount of protein in our meals and and protein is actually even more satisfying than fat or carbs, we’re less likely to overeat or have cravings and also support so many other essential functions we need for good health and fitness. As I’ve talked about a lot before, for instance, the amino acids from the protein we eat help support our muscle tissue repair and strength, but also they form the building blocks for the neurotransmitters in our brain supporting cognitive function and our mood regulation. They help us form important chemical messengers in our body like enzymes and hormones. They also support a healthy immune response, which keeps us from getting sick and helps us get better faster and heal more quickly. So we want those amino acids because they, they do just so much for us.
(11:24)
And including the right amount of protein at every age as women is super, super important. And our needs really do change over time. So we don’t absorb the amino acids from the protein foods we eat as readily as we age. That’s why I recommend if you’re over 40, you consider upping your protein intake and especially paying attention to this if you are active and regularly contributing to muscle breakdown, which is what happens when we exercise, right? We need the amino acids from the protein eat to help rebuild that tissue, as I was saying. And a lot of other important jobs too. If we don’t have enough amino acids circulating in our body from our last meal, the body breaks down our muscle tissue to access the amino acids stored there, which totally undermines your hard work and the reason you were exercising in the first place.
(12:12)
And we know that cortisol from stress also contributes to muscle breakdown and fat storage. So this leads me back to our important topic for today, which is how to support our body’s stress response system and why stress management is one of my four pillars of health. And if you haven’t heard me talk about the four pillars of health before, they are sleep, nutrition, stress management, and exercise. And these four things work together in your body to create this optimal state for things like fat loss to occur, for you to have good energy for you to be able to build and strengthen and sculpt lean muscle. And as we’ve been talking about, the stress response impacts so many systems in our body, but how do we know if we’re stressed or if we’re even dealing with the impacts of high levels of cortisol? So first, you may just know because you feel more anxious or stressed out frequently, but if you want some data to back that up, you can get your blood or urine tested.
(13:08)
Usually my doctor has me do a couple of different types of tests. A Dutch test checks my cortisol and sex hormones and you have to urinate at specific times of day at a specific point in your cycle for that one. Then there are blood tests. And if your doctor is looking at cortisol levels, they’ll usually have you get a blood test first thing in the morning before you eat. There are other times of day they might ask you to do that too, just depending on what they’re looking at. So make sure you really follow their, their guidance. If you wanna get a clear picture of where your cortisol levels are at specific points of the day, you can also get your blood pressure checked. If you see your doctor, they probably check your blood pressure. And learning your ranges can be really helpful in establishing a baseline.
(13:48)
If our blood pressure is high, it can indicate that our heart is working too hard. And if you’re chronically experiencing stress, this can elevate your heart rate and create that higher blood pressure. One way that you can sort of self monitor your stress levels is to check in with your heart rate over time to get a baseline number for yourself. And you can take your own heart rate by setting a timer and feeling your pulse and counting the beats per minute. Many wearable devices are also gonna give you heart rate monitor. And one thing that I suggest with any of these self-monitoring methods is to look for patterns over time, not to take a single data point as the only indicator of your range, especially as women since our hormone levels are gonna fluctuate. And this can cause some variation in our stress response.
(14:33)
And you know, for instance, I wear an Oura ring, which tells me my resting heart rate daily. I try to look at trends when I look at that data. Like I was saying, I can usually tell when like my resting heart rate is elevated above my normal range, and it’s usually pretty easy to pinpoint the stressor in my life that’s causing my heart to beat faster. But sometimes I need to do a little investigation because it could be coming from a food that’s causing me to have a reaction to it. It could be coming from where I’m at in my cycle. It could be that something’s stressing me out and I’m not really tuning into that fact. And it’s just really interesting stuff to think about. So another interesting metric is our heart rate variability or HRV for short. And this is how frequently your heart beats.
(15:15)
And it’s an important stress indicator, though the ranges are highly individualized. HRV is linked to your autonomic nervous system and the balance between the parasympathetic nervous system, which is our rest and digest response, and the sympathetic nervous system, which is our fight or flight response. Your autonomic nervous system helps balance these systems and helps you respond to the daily stressors and regulate your heart rate, your breathing rate and your digestion. And HRV rate helps us to estimate the balance within the autonomic nervous system. The nervous system influences how your heart beats your rest and digest system tells your heart rate to slow down, which creates more variability between the beats of your heart and your fight or flight system tells your heart rate to speed up, which decreases the space for variability between the beats. And these two systems can really vary over time. They can be like pushing and pulling against each other throughout the day.
(16:09)
So as a general rule, when you’re looking at HRV for clues as to how your body is handling stress, a higher HRV is associated more with the rest and digest state general fitness and like good recovery where the lower HRV is gonna be associated with the fight or flight response, stress illness or over training. And that really brings me to how we can work on increasing our body’s resilience to stress. I mentioned that over training can impact your heart rate variability, which is an indicator that your body has too much stress to handle. But we also know that exercise is a hallmark of a healthy lifestyle and something that can help bring our stress levels down. And I’ve, I’ve said before that exercise is a healthy stress when we are healthy. Exercise is actually a fantastic way to build more resilience to stress. But we must approach this process with respect for our energy levels, our capacity for the workouts we’re doing at any given time, and the way we nourish ourselves with the building blocks the body needs around our workouts.
(17:09)
And this really becomes essential to pay attention to as our hormone levels change as women. First, we wanna be mindful of not over training when we’re still in our cycling years, approaching our period when estrogen levels are lower and progesterone levels are higher. This time of our cycle is when our basal body temperature is slightly heightened and our sleep is often disrupted as a result, meaning we won’t recover quite as efficiently as we do in the first half of our cycle when estrogen is higher. We also have slightly elevated levels of inflammation in our body in this second half of the cycle leading up to our period. So backing off on the training intensity can help your body handle the stress response better. But having a regular exercise practice is awesome and supportive as a life practice, and we should cultivate that. And I really encourage you, you know, to use balanced training plans, my balanced training plans for instance, and follow your natural cycle and energy levels throughout the month as you approach your workouts.
(18:08)
You’ll also really benefit from following my strategic training plans if you’re in perimenopause, when estrogen and progesterone levels start to become erratic and imbalanced and, and our testosterone begins to drop because I am customizing the programs for women in this life stage. And the shifting of our hormones has this compounding effect of making it harder for you to recover from your training and support that muscle repair and rebuilding, plus lose body fat. But if you pay attention to strategically timed recovery days and up the intensity of the workouts when you train, you won’t be overtaxing your stress response system. You can start to give your body the time it needs to repair and recover and keep your system working efficiently even as your hormone levels begin to decline. This is also so important for you post menopause. This is when you wanna absolutely be polarizing your training, making the workouts you do really effective by coming to them rested and recovered, and of course fueled this will really help you enjoy a healthy stress response to the workouts you do and have the recovery time you need since estrogen and progesterone levels that used to help drive our muscle and bone remodeling and testosterone have dropped off and we just don’t bounce back as quickly from our workouts.
(19:19)
Of course, I have custom schedules for you in my programs for that. So in a nutshell, exercise is important to your body and can help you have more resilience to stress. But if we are over training, we’re simply exacerbating the stress response and causing greater inflammation than we can effectively recover from. Now I’ve mentioned the importance of eating whole foods already in this conversation, but that is another factor that will contribute to your body’s ability to mitigate and handle stress. These are all like the little dials that you can turn yourself, that add up to these really big results, right? Not one of them alone is going to do it all for you. They all have to be turned incrementally and daily to make an impact. Now the other part that I think people think about the most when I say stress management in the context of the four pillars of health is meditation or mindfulness practices.
(20:09)
And the reason I bring up practices that help us tune in and be more present is because of the way this contributes to activating the parasympathetic nervous system that rest and digest state that calms our body and helps us deal with anxiety and stress. And the more we practice things like this, the more resilience we build into our stress response system. We’re always gonna be dealing with stress and having to process it. Life is full of the unexpected, but when you regularly practice strengthening your response to stress and mindfully bringing yourself into a calm state, the easier it becomes to self-regulate and get yourself back to a calm state in the face of stressful events. And this will help lower your blood pressure, lower your resting heart rate, improve your heart rate variability, because all of those physical response symptoms are directly tied to your fight or flight and rest and digest autonomic nervous system.
(21:05)
Think about it. We’re always making the time to exercise – sometimes too much time is spent exercising and we know now how overtraining can backfire. And the exercise we do can help us become stronger physically, making us more capable of handling physical tasks, giving us the power and strength to enjoy sports and playing with our kids and with our pets. | But we rarely schedule time to help our body build stress resilience. And my thought for you today is that if you can start any practice that will help you do this, help you calm your nervous system, even when you are not feeling stressed, you will build the resilience into yourself to help you deal more effectively with all that life throws your way, especially when it’s unexpected, because you’ll have those tools at the ready. So here are just a few ideas and practices you might like to try that I really like, and you might have some suggestions of your own to add, and if you do, please share them.
(21:53)
You could try scheduling 10 to 15 minutes a day on your calendar to start with one or any of these practices if you like. So for instance, there’s this great mindfulness practice that my friend Emily Fletcher from Ziva Meditation taught me called Come to Your Senses and you can actually follow along with it in one of our previous podcast episodes. And that’s where you sit quietly and tune in to each of your five senses, one at a time. That is a very grounding activity that you can use as a segue into a meditation or even just on its own to bring you into your body. Then there are breathing practices, like things like box breathing, where you breathe in for a certain count, you hold your breath at the top of the breath cycle briefly, then you exhale on a certain count, you pause and repeat.
(22:40)
That can be a very restful breathing technique for many people. And there are many other great breathing techniques. One that comes to mind that I really like is alternate nostril breathing. This has a lot of research behind it and it has a really fast effect on calming your nervous system. That’s where you’re gonna cover one nostril and breathe in and then breathe out and then cover the other nostril and breathe in and breathe out. And then you continue to alternate. And there are some variations on this where you can breathe in on one side and breathe out on the other side. So you might wanna play around with that and look it up if it sounds interesting. Tapping is a practice that you can do yourself also that targets the meridian points in the body in a similar way to the acupuncture meridians. This is something I’m not super experienced with, but it’s, it’s got a great reputation and it’s worth mentioning.
(23:27)
And if it sounds interesting, I encourage you to follow up with your own research and practice of it. And since I mentioned acupuncture, I’ll give that a plug right now too though, that’s something you’d need to see a practitioner for. I have really had tremendous success in seeing an acupuncturist pretty regularly when I first started going into perimenopause, working with her definitely helped to calm my nervous system and it had a lot of proven benefits including to help regulate our hormone levels and balance them. And you can actually hear an interview I did with her from last season on the podcast. If you’re curious about acupuncture, seeing a professional or a therapist can be a great way to support your stress response. You know, so many of us have so much on our plate and you know, having professional support can be a real game changer.
(24:12)
Dealing with the aftermath of trauma or PTSD can leave your body in a heightened state of fight or flight and remain unresolved for years, causing you to be dealing with high levels of the stress response hormones. Despite all your best efforts, there are many types of therapy that can be effective and supportive for many different types of reasons and many different needs. And it’s very individually specific. Of course, for PTSD and Adverse Childhood events, I recommend looking into EMDR therapy. If you haven’t heard of it before, I personally had a lot of positive experiences with it and I feel like it was a real game changer for me. But back to those daily practices that you can do on your own. One of the big ones for me that I know is really effective for so many people is using some type of journaling practice.
(24:57)
Whether you use your journal to just get stuff out of your head, organize your thoughts, or actively write down the things you’re grateful for, journaling is a powerful tool that connects us to our mind in a very special way. And you know, speaking of gratitude, that’s such a powerful mindset shifting tool that can really help us alleviate stress and anxiety when we’re dealing with it. So practicing it regularly, even when we’re not feeling anxious or stressed, can help us bring it to mind more easily as it becomes another one of those ingrained tools in the toolkit of our mind. Walking is another one that you can do, which has a lot of benefits for our health. Like so many low impact activities do. It can help calm our nervous system and also stimulate fat loss. If you can get out into nature and walk daily, it’s amazing for you.
(25:44)
Being in nature in general is wonderful for the stress response. You know, breathing fresh air, being in the trees or mountains or by the water, it has a very calming effect on our bodies. But of course that’s really dependent on where we live and what’s accessible to us. So it’s good to have a variety of options and practices that you can do on your own that don’t cost any money and are just available to anyone anytime. So when it comes to meditation practices, I learned a practice where I just focus on a word and I sit with that the mind will wander, but I come back to the word as I can and that focus is really helpful for me. There are so many other ways to meditate and, and meditation practices that you can look into and learn. I just wanted to share one that I use.
(26:28)
You can use apps like Calm or the Balance app or checkout HeartMath, which has a small device you can connect to your body while you’re using it to synchronize your heart, your brain, and your nervous system through your breathing. It’s really cool. I realized I’d be remiss if I didn’t also mention the benefits of adaptogenic herbs. They are medicinal plants that can really help enhance your body’s natural resistance to stress and increase the rates of oxygen, protein, fat, and sugar utilization. And they, they function by impacting that HPA access that we talked about earlier. And that’s how your brain talks to your hormones basically. And they can be really useful for a host of different symptoms that involve the stress response, like depression, anxiety, mood related issues, all kinds of things to do with hormone balance, hot flashes, night sweats, helping to reregulate estrogen and progesterone imbalance.
(27:23)
And there is just really a lot of really good interesting evidence and research around the adaptogens. However they are, while they are plants, they are also medicinal plants and I definitely recommend that you use some blood tests to see where your hormones are at when you go to use these or do your own research on, you know, what the contraindications are for using certain adaptogens. You can read a really cool article over on my blog about adaptogens. I, I feature six of them that I’ve personally used that helps support our hormone balance. And you can read the indications and contraindications for them if you’re interested in just getting started on that journey of research. And then you can take it from there and, and get even more information as you, as you look into your own levels of, of hormones in your own body. And you know, check in with, with what might be beneficial for you specifically.
(28:20)
Now I realize I have just scratched the surface of this very complex conversation about our body’s stress response and the way it interweaves with our other hormones and life experience. But I really hope I’ve given you some food for thought and some inspiration to begin or even pick up a practice that suits you in supporting your body’s ability to manage your stress. And of course, I’ll be super interested to hear from you and anything that you have to share, remember you can leave me a comment on the show notes page for this episode, get the transcript and any links to things I mention in the show right over on my blog, the betty rocker.com in the podcast category. And you’ll also find my guides to training with your cycle training in perimenopause and training post menopause. You can also find that article I mentioned about adaptogens in the women’s health section, and you can access my custom programming for women in all life stages in rock your life, my online home workout studio and women’s fitness membership where I have customized programming for every program in there for women in different life stages, which is a really cool way to stay balanced with your workout program.
(29:26)
You have access to all of the recipes and the support from myself and the team Betty Rocker coaches. You can also check out my whole Betty supplement collection where I have support for the full spectrum of the four pillars of health. And I invite you to shop my store anytime and see what’s in there that might be of of benefit for you over at thebettyrocker.com. So thanks again so much for listening and for being here. I love spending time with you. And as always, I’m Betty Rocker and you are so awesome, Flawsome and amazing. I’ll talk to you again very soon. Bye for now.
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